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Topic: Who done it???????, First cache ever placed.....< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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    Posted: June 13 2002,10:41 pm QUOTE

My wife and I were wondering where and when the first cache was placed as well as who placed it.  Is this cache still there, and what part of the earth is it located???  We have tried to look this information up on the internet but there seems to be a few different stories.  


:rotflmao
Upinyachit
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Posted: June 14 2002,2:33 am QUOTE

Hey that was an easy one!!

Found this on geocaching.................................................

"Credits
When the GPS signal degradation called Select Availabilty (SA) was removed by the Clinton Administration May 1st, 2000 (statement), it opened up the possibility of games like this one.

On May 3rd, a container of goodies was hidden by a someone outside of Portland, Oregon - in celebration of the removing of Selective Availability. By May 6th the cache was visited twice, and logged in the logbook once.

Mike Teague was the first to find the container, and built the first web site to document these containers and their locations that were posted to the sci.geo.satellite-nav newsgroup."

Dx

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"Have you no news on your travels?" from the Book of Fairy and Folk Tales of Ireland
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GeoRockers Offline
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Posted: June 14 2002,3:30 am QUOTE

Geocaching's roots are in the sci.geo.satellite-nav newsgroup.

Dave Ulmer announced the idea here, on May 3, 2000.

Dave hid the first stash (cache) near Estacada, Oregon on May 4, 2000.

It was found within a few hours of the post.

Mike Teague hid the 2nd and 3rd stashes (caches).  

Mike started the first stash (cache) web site.

Here is the preliminary FAQ.

I hope this helps. :)

George

Edited by GeoRockers on --

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A 1/1 via the trail around the hill?
Nah... that's too easy!  Let's go up and over!
Why follow a trail when we can blaze our own? :p

We *make* mountains out of mole hills!
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    Posted: June 14 2002,9:01 am QUOTE

Quote
Hey that was an easy one!!

Found this on geocaching.................................................

I hate to say it, but geocaching.com is a poor source for the history of the hobby. geocaching.com fails to credit Dave Ulmer for inventing the hobby (it says "someone" hid the first cache). geocaching.com also once claimed that Jeremy Irish coined the term "geocaching". He had to back off that claim when others provided evidence that Matt Stum deserves credit for that. But geocaching.com fails to credit him and still leaves the impression that Jeremy Irish was the first to use the term.

The best source for the history of the hobby can be found in the gpsstash archives on Yahoo. Unfortunately, the moderator of that group has recently changed the settings to require moderator approval of all posts. And he doesn't seem to be approving any. I'm afraid this rich source on the history of the hobby could be deleted at any time without notice, all at the whim of that moderator. That would be a shame.

Edited by Scout on --

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Rocky Offline
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    Posted: June 14 2002,9:12 am QUOTE

The 57th cache ever placed was by our own GPS Fool, Greg Mosher, "The Spot" located near Naples, NY and still active although now in a ammo can in place of the original plastic bucket with screw on lid.  It was out for 9 months undisturbed before some guy,  "Quinnow" logged it on his second attempt, and the rest is History.
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Posted: June 14 2002,10:39 am QUOTE

Scout.......

Ya know I did think it was strange when geocaching.com didn't list the original cache placer.........

Hmmmm........

I guess that it wasn't as easy as I had thought......

Kinda like Hinge Thunder's Cache.....there but ya have to "dig" a little deeper.

Dx

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"Have you no news on your travels?" from the Book of Fairy and Folk Tales of Ireland
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Spanktacular Offline
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    Posted: July 05 2002,8:33 pm QUOTE

http://forums.groundspeak.com/cgi-bin....:000001

If you're going to sling mud around, at least make sure it's the right mud.

It's not strange at all that Ulmer isn't mentioned by name at geocaching.com, as a matter of fact.  That nutcase Ulmer demanded that his name be removed from the caches in question and that he not be associated with geocaching any longer.  So, in effect, you're violating his wishes right now.

He threw a tantrum and left geocaching.com and went to start his new game "geopoints" or something like that.  It never materialized.  Perhaps he's institutionlized somewhere...or he plans on blaming someone else.  Again.
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Scout Offline
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    Posted: July 05 2002,10:39 pm QUOTE

Quote
If you're going to sling mud around, at least make sure it's the right mud.

You are probably right that Dave Ulmer does not mind that geocaching.com fails to credit him. And Jeremy Irish probably doesn't mind, either. The result is as I said: geocaching.com is a poor source for the history of geocaching. Try the gpsstash archive instead. I still worry that this rich source is at risk. The moderator can delete it at will at any time.

By the way, Spank, what "mud" were you referring to? Your own post best resembles that characterization.

Edited by Scout on --

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Spanktacular Offline
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    Posted: July 06 2002,10:59 am QUOTE

What mud?  Oh, just the usual "Dave Ulmer is a god on Earth but Jeremy is a bad man for trying to make a few bucks while I buy my Navicache shirt like a raging hypocrite" mud.   :0o
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    Posted: July 06 2002,12:43 pm QUOTE

Wow...
As far as mud goes, that only happens on the trails when it rains. Everyone has the right to express thier opinion, obviously.....
But the TOPIC is WHO done it not who profited by it.  But... since a fellow navicache member brought that topic up, I will
comment on that too. ???

Every one knows it's all about the money, but can you imagine how much profit is being made off of that little bug?  Or the membership fee?  I don't think the t-shirt compares. (you can go on a navicache adventure and sooner or later you will find one anyways; we did!) :p

The t shirt is of great quality and that obviously has to be covered cost-wise.  It would be rude of anyone to expect a t shirt for practically free.  The cost of the t shirts are a fair price to ask.  :angry:

Upinyachit
:)
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    Posted: July 06 2002,2:11 pm QUOTE

Quote (Spanktacular @ July 06 2002,06:59 am)
What mud?  Oh, just the usual "Dave Ulmer is a god on Earth but Jeremy is a bad man for trying to make a few bucks while I buy my Navicache shirt like a raging hypocrite" mud.

One shouldn't put quotes around sentences that he makes up himself. It gives the mistaken impression that someone else actually said these things. Your characterization of others' opinions on this board is mistaken.

Take a step back and try opening the conversation again, less antagonistic this time, and you'll probably find you can get a decent dialog going on these boards.

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Hinge Thunder Offline
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    Posted: July 06 2002,2:15 pm QUOTE

Quote (Spanktacular @ July 06 2002,12:59 pm)
What mud?  Oh, just the usual "Dave Ulmer is a god on Earth but Jeremy is a bad man for trying to make a few bucks while I buy my Navicache shirt like a raging hypocrite" mud.   :0o

I looked through the thread, and saw nowhere where anyone said this Ulmer guy is a God. I also didn't see anywhere that Jeremy is described as a 'bad man'. And as far as the t-shirts, we aren't required to buy them to use the service.

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Quinn Offline
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    Posted: July 06 2002,2:38 pm QUOTE

Quote
What mud?  Oh, just the usual "Dave Ulmer is a god on Earth but Jeremy is a bad man for trying to make a few bucks while I buy my Navicache shirt like a raging hypocrite" mud.   :0o

Okay, lets clear this up a tad... It was you that mentioned "make sure it's the right mud"!

I sell shirts on the website to cover the very small cost of server space that the site requires. Not once have I ever said other wise. By the way you act like I have five people packing these shirts as if millions are going out the door daily. If a shirt sells, fine! but to be honest they only sell once in a while and it's no big deal to me either way.

Now, lets get to the "right" mud. Not sure who you are or what your intentions are in posting here (which is all fine and dandy) But just try to go into Jeremy's forum and type the word "Navicache" and see what happens, it gets censored.
3/4 of actual facts about who created Geocaching and the true story behind it have all been censored and deleted from those very forums. The only time you see something left in is if by chance it seems to make him look good in the public eye.

For the better part of a year and a half I have heard nothing but how he wants to only help the sport and keep it from falling into the hands of other wanting to turn it commercial, well take a better look because thats exactly what that site is and nothing more. People have very positive opinions of him and they are entitled to feel that way, I on the other hand have extremely negative feelings based on facts that I myself have encountered (most of them directly from him to me)

This fellow watched the sport become created, then quickly ran out and app'd for copy right as if he were the one that came up with the idea. Heck...he even told the reporters he "coined" the term.

When Navicache was first placed on the net I was contacted by Jeremy telling me that if I did not remove the word "Geocaching" from my website that I would face a lawsuit, and I was not the only one that was threatened with this as Buxleys Maps were also contacted in this fashion.

So if you are trying to compare my single shirts to "charter memberships, Travel bugs, shirts, hats, bags, pads, stickers, etc...you are really reaching here bud!

Last July I did a national News story that was placed on ABC with Peter Jennings that ran for over 7 on air minutes. I mentioned the sport and all the pro's behind it for the family life. I mentioned Navicache.com (I'd be a fool not to) and I also mentioned Geocaching.com and Buxleys maps repeatedly as well. The crew was here for about 6-7 hours doing the story, but when it hit the tube much of what I had said ended up on the editing room floor including all the nice things I said about Geocaching.com...

So here I was doing the sport as well as ALL the sites a favor by plugging them on national TV, but not once was any site address mentioned and Geocaching.com was left out completely. Now when Jeremy caught word of this the first thing he said in his own forums was that I was only thinking of myself and how rude it was of me that I left out any mention of him or his site (remember the editing room floor)

But in any case, just how many times has he mentioned Navicache in those countless stories he has done? Zippo!

Now remember, you want me to respect your opinions, then I ask you respect mine and I just laid them out on the floor for you to see. It is my opinion that site could care less about the land we use for the sport as long as it continues to pump money into the pockets of those involved. Making money is all well and good, and there is nothing wrong with it by any means, but don't lie to me and tell me that "it's not about the money" and that "I am not making any profit" or "I am only doing this for the good of the sport", when you and I both know better.

In this forum you can say the word "geocaching" or even link to another site, try that there with the word "Navicache"

Let me know if you want a list of people that were banned from the use of that site because they simply said they liked Navicache too.

You ever wonder what keeps that site from going completely "Pay to play"?   the answer is right in front of your face at this very moment.

I won't go as far as placing all of his e-mails to me here for the public to see, but I can assure you that my opinions about this matter were well thought out and do not come without fact.

By the way...I honestly welcome you to the forums here and I can assure you it's very hard to tell what one's intentions are merely from text on a screen. I sincerely hope you find something within these pages that make you return  :)  I am also sure you will find that many people (most) are very kind hearted and wish to do nothing more than help others here.
So please do not let my comments backlash into having you think this was in any way about you, I just happen to have been there when this all came about so I think I know a bit more (could be wrong though it wouldn't be the first time)

And my opinions on Dave U?  I like the fellow and respect his ideas. He voiced his thoughts and stood by them and was called names for doing so. And YES! quite a bit of what he said was removed so many people do not know the complete story.

Edited by Quinn on --

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Spanktacular Offline
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    Posted: July 06 2002,7:24 pm QUOTE

Quote
One shouldn't put quotes around sentences that he makes up himself. It gives the mistaken impression that someone else actually said these things. Your characterization of others' opinions on this board is mistaken.

Take a step back and try opening the conversation again, less antagonistic this time, and you'll probably find you can get a decent dialog going on these boards.


Get yourself a copy of Strunk and White's before you tell me how to use quotes...   :0o
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    Posted: July 06 2002,7:30 pm QUOTE

Yikes, Quinn.  Rant much?

Look, I've been lurking here for a long time and there's a very definite anti-geocaching.com feeling that just permeates the place.  I saw one more thread that slagged geocaching.com just a bit and I had enough.

Ulmer demanded to have his name removed from those caches and comments in this thread made it appear like it was just more geocaching.com conspiracy crap.

So, I did my research in geocaching.com's own archived forums and tried to set the record straight.

I don't care if you like it or not.  Instead of suppositions and anectdotal evidence, I went straight to the source and dug it up.
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    Posted: July 06 2002,7:57 pm QUOTE

Quote (Spanktacular @ July 06 2002,9:30 pm)
Look, I've been lurking here for a long time and there's a very definite anti-geocaching.com feeling that just permeates the place.  I saw one more thread that slagged geocaching.com just a bit and I had enough.

Dude, you are a jerk. You've only made four posts at this point, and they are all trying to stir up trouble. At least you CAN mention geocaching.com here. As Quinn said, try mentioning Navicache.com over on the other site. In the forums over there, some guy posted that he found a cache type box, but couldn't find a listing for it on Geocaching. I tried to post that he could look to see if it was on navicache. com, but the post was filtered due to 'objectionable' language (the mention of navicache). Personally, I am on both sites, and like both.  Both sites have their good points and bad points. Too bad your posts add to the bad points column.

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Quinn Offline
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    Posted: July 06 2002,8:06 pm QUOTE

There is a very large difference between "Rant" and correcting someone who does NOT know the true facts yet seems to think he does. If you mean "went to the source" as to what Jeremy has told you directly then I would put the same value on that as you would get for placing a golf course in a florida swamp.

I was in the forum when Dave was venting his anger over having one of his cache logs deleted by Jeremy as a result of speaking his mind in that log. Censorship is the name of the game over there and as you can see it is not the way we run the show here.

You hashed up a topic that was close to a month old from it's last post (for whatever reason who cares) but to come here and tell me and others that we are wrong when I have all the e-mails and copy of the threads and posts is kind of absurd.

You can do all the "research" of archived forum posts you want, that research is only as good as what you see, but it's the posts that were REMOVED that you need to base your facts on. DAVE only asked for his posts to be removed ONLY after several others he made were censored and deleted, when those posts were censored and deleted it was made to have his remaining ones put him in a bad light and look like the bad guy, and THAT was the reason he wanted the others taken out...I got this directly from him in a two way convo as well as seen this happen with my own eyes.

Jeremy lets threads go on in his forums as long as it makes his site and him look good, if it seems to go the other way even if facts are being spoken the thread gets locked...case in point a thread based on Navicache.com ... the first poster was anti Navicache, then a volley of Pro Navicache posters followed up his comments to dispute his opinion, then presto! the thread was locked and closed. Kind of like a 5 year old saying if you don't play the game my way I will take my toys and go home.

And if you are such a PRO Geocaching dude, why are you here or even bother? If you have been here quite some time...why?

The only posts you make have been negative so far, are we part family there or something?

So yes...you will find many people speaking lowly of Jeremy and several speaking highly of him, I for one am not afraid of voicing my thoughts as you can see, and yes I do hold a grudge when someone tells me they will file a lawsuit for using a word that he didnt even create.

So, the door to that forum is unlocked to you and you seem to like it all that much better, don't waste your time here then if you don't like it so much.

Edited by Quinn on --

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    Posted: July 06 2002,9:57 pm QUOTE

Quote (Spanktacular @ July 06 2002,3:24 pm)
Get yourself a copy of Strunk and White's before you tell me how to use quotes...

Got it. Good reference, by the way. Support yourself with a quote from it and I'll change my opinion of you. In fact, support any of your claims about what others are saying with some actual quotes from either here or geocaching.com and I might change my opinion of you. Until then, I stand by my statements that your charges are baseless.

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    Posted: July 06 2002,10:30 pm QUOTE

I stated how and why I posted what I did.  Something was said and implied that Ulmer was getting stiffed for credit when Ulmer is the one who demanded his name be removed.  I posted a link to the "hidden" threads detailing this whole exchange (including the originally deleted cache log entry in a post) as evidence that IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, the geocaching.com-bashing was off-base.

That's it.  I'm tired of the one-sided view here, and there (geocaching.com), for that matter.  A little balance here would be good.

Oh, and Quinn.  Brevity counts.

Edited by Quinn on --
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Posted: July 07 2002,3:16 am QUOTE

WOW!  (brevity, levity & secrecy)

The thread above was a waste of my time, but I suppose necessary in an open forum.  (clarity)

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Quinn Offline
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    Posted: July 07 2002,4:59 am QUOTE

Quote (Spanktacular @ July 07 2002,12:30 am)
Iremoved.  I posted a link to the "hidden" threads detailing this whole exchange (including the originally deleted cache log entry in a post) as evidence that IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, the geocaching.com-bashing was off-base.

That's it.  I'm tired of the one-sided view here, and there (geocaching.com), for that matter.  A little balance here would be good.

You have got to be kidding me! Just how many times were you dropped as a youngster? what part of removing and censoring posts is it that you just do not understand? you keep saying you went though the "WHOLE EXCHANGE" in that forum and I am telling you that you could not have because much of what was said there was deleted and removed.

It is quite clear to me now your main intent of coming here in the first place, once in a great while we get a flamer such as yourself that thinks and acts like his/her word is the way things must have been. If I handed you a book and ripped out 20 pages and then asked you what happened you could only give me the facts from what you have read, this is exactly what you are doing now and don't even realize it.

And things here are not "one sided" by us, but it is you that have a one sided view and are getting upset because others are not supporting your comments. You have made a firm stance that anything that happened on the other site must have been completely at the fault of dave U and nobody else.
And I am glad that you are "Tired" of the way things are here so that maybe you will go back and spend more time researching the facts before you come in here and vomit the crud you have in the past few posts.

As for that stick I see you know exactly where to look from past experience huh? ;)

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    Posted: July 07 2002,5:05 am QUOTE

By the way...see what happens when someone censors or edits a post?

From the get go I said I would allow anything here other than foul language, thus your post was cleaned up by me for two reasons, 1) to get rid of the commented word, and 2) to show exactly what I was getting at by "you only know what you are able to read"

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    Posted: July 07 2002,7:56 am QUOTE

Quote (Spanktacular @ July 06 2002,6:30 pm)
Something was said and implied that Ulmer was getting stiffed for credit when Ulmer is the one who demanded his name be removed.  I posted a link to the "hidden" threads detailing this whole exchange (including the originally deleted cache log entry in a post) as evidence that IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, the geocaching.com-bashing was off-base.

The trouble is, the thread you referenced doesn't address the matter at hand at all. The original discussion was about the history of geocaching as documented at geocaching.com. Not about cache logs.

For your thread to be relevant, you would have to demonstrate that (1) geocaching.com's history ever properly credited Dave Ulmer with inventing the sport, (2) he requested that history be changed to remove his name, and (3) Jeremy Irish complied.

The fact remains that geocaching.com is a poor place to go for a history of the hobby.

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    Posted: July 07 2002,5:10 pm QUOTE

:0 Whew! What was the original question?

Sounds like the answer is Dave Ulmer in Portland, Oregon.

To all other readers: Please don't ask for the coordinates. ???

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Posted: July 08 2002,9:16 am QUOTE

And Now for Something Really Different...

Upinyachit....I think I found major mud on your cache.....mixed with clay....made my knee high boots slip and slide........then couldn't find the cache........

But I must say that it was a cache I will never forget and the return trip was even better cause I had chatted with you, found a great restuarant and very much enjoyed your cache......

My point.......something good can come out of any kinda mud...

Here.......I really like this site and think that I work on both sites well......but would much rather "hang" with ya'all

BTW.....my Strawberry Fields Forever Cache is way way navicache..........just check out the top of the box!!

DX

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    Posted: Mar. 02 2006,6:41 pm QUOTE

Quote (Quinn @ July 06 2002,4:38 pm)
Quote
What mud?  Oh, just the usual "Dave Ulmer is a god on Earth but Jeremy is a bad man for trying to make a few bucks while I buy my Navicache shirt like a raging hypocrite" mud.   :0o

Okay, lets clear this up a tad... It was you that mentioned "make sure it's the right mud"!

I sell shirts on the website to cover the very small cost of server space that the site requires. Not once have I ever said other wise. By the way you act like I have five people packing these shirts as if millions are going out the door daily. If a shirt sells, fine! but to be honest they only sell once in a while and it's no big deal to me either way.

Now, lets get to the "right" mud. Not sure who you are or what your intentions are in posting here (which is all fine and dandy) But just try to go into Jeremy's forum and type the word "Navicache" and see what happens, it gets censored.
3/4 of actual facts about who created Geocaching and the true story behind it have all been censored and deleted from those very forums. The only time you see something left in is if by chance it seems to make him look good in the public eye.

For the better part of a year and a half I have heard nothing but how he wants to only help the sport and keep it from falling into the hands of other wanting to turn it commercial, well take a better look because thats exactly what that site is and nothing more. People have very positive opinions of him and they are entitled to feel that way, I on the other hand have extremely negative feelings based on facts that I myself have encountered (most of them directly from him to me)

This fellow watched the sport become created, then quickly ran out and app'd for copy right as if he were the one that came up with the idea. Heck...he even told the reporters he "coined" the term.

When Navicache was first placed on the net I was contacted by Jeremy telling me that if I did not remove the word "Geocaching" from my website that I would face a lawsuit, and I was not the only one that was threatened with this as Buxleys Maps were also contacted in this fashion.

So if you are trying to compare my single shirts to "charter memberships, Travel bugs, shirts, hats, bags, pads, stickers, etc...you are really reaching here bud!

Last July I did a national News story that was placed on ABC with Peter Jennings that ran for over 7 on air minutes. I mentioned the sport and all the pro's behind it for the family life. I mentioned Navicache.com (I'd be a fool not to) and I also mentioned Geocaching.com and Buxleys maps repeatedly as well. The crew was here for about 6-7 hours doing the story, but when it hit the tube much of what I had said ended up on the editing room floor including all the nice things I said about Geocaching.com...

So here I was doing the sport as well as ALL the sites a favor by plugging them on national TV, but not once was any site address mentioned and Geocaching.com was left out completely. Now when Jeremy caught word of this the first thing he said in his own forums was that I was only thinking of myself and how rude it was of me that I left out any mention of him or his site (remember the editing room floor)

But in any case, just how many times has he mentioned Navicache in those countless stories he has done? Zippo!

Now remember, you want me to respect your opinions, then I ask you respect mine and I just laid them out on the floor for you to see. It is my opinion that site could care less about the land we use for the sport as long as it continues to pump money into the pockets of those involved. Making money is all well and good, and there is nothing wrong with it by any means, but don't lie to me and tell me that "it's not about the money" and that "I am not making any profit" or "I am only doing this for the good of the sport", when you and I both know better.

In this forum you can say the word "geocaching" or even link to another site, try that there with the word "Navicache"

Let me know if you want a list of people that were banned from the use of that site because they simply said they liked Navicache too.

You ever wonder what keeps that site from going completely "Pay to play"?   the answer is right in front of your face at this very moment.

I won't go as far as placing all of his e-mails to me here for the public to see, but I can assure you that my opinions about this matter were well thought out and do not come without fact.

By the way...I honestly welcome you to the forums here and I can assure you it's very hard to tell what one's intentions are merely from text on a screen. I sincerely hope you find something within these pages that make you return  :)  I am also sure you will find that many people (most) are very kind hearted and wish to do nothing more than help others here.
So please do not let my comments backlash into having you think this was in any way about you, I just happen to have been there when this all came about so I think I know a bit more (could be wrong though it wouldn't be the first time)

And my opinions on Dave U?  I like the fellow and respect his ideas. He voiced his thoughts and stood by them and was called names for doing so. And YES! quite a bit of what he said was removed so many people do not know the complete story.

Hello.  I have a strong interest in history and I am a regular participant of the Groundspeak forums where I have been recently discussing this subject.     I came to these forums specifically to reinforce my research about the true history of geocaching.  Of course, everybody knows that Dave Ulmer hid the first stash.  And some know that a dispute between two people resulted in tarnishing the true history that is published at Groundspeak.

My research has been extensive; I know there are topics that have been deleted that would be helpful to understanding this sad dilemma.  I am not a Jeremy basher, or for that matter any kind of basher.  I just respect history, especially relating to my own interests such as geocaching.

Having read almost everything available on the internet, I have found very little that Dave Ulmer has said publicly that is negative about geocaching.  I did see where he called Jeremy an “idiot” in the Groundspeak forums.  Also, in a
post somewhere else, he stated:

From: "David J. Ulmer" Date: Mon Jun 12, 2000 10:45pm Subject: Problems with GeoCaching... You really don't see the problems with a sport until you get deeply involved in it. As the one that has placed the most stashes so far, I began to seethe problems that it created. Some of my stashes are placed on tree farms owned by a large corporation. They are not, No Trespassing areas but they are private property. I didn't think too much about it at first because woods is woods around here, and a cache bucket seems like a pretty benign thing. The problem I saw was with the published coordinates attached to an uninvited bucket attached to my name could some day cause trouble. Some corporate dude five years from now could decide to prosecute me for littering or something just for the fun of it. For that reason I've decided to remove the stash buckets but keep the coordinates that are interesting for another game....

But there was obviously more to it than that.  BTW, in the Groundspeak topic linked above, I state that I have received an email from Ulmer (just this week) in which he denies that he ever asked for his name to be removed from that website.  Also, there are links in that topic that demonstrate quite clearly that, at one time, Groundspeak did publicly recognize Ulmer as the inventor of geocaching.

So I ask some of the geoldtimers who may frequent these boards to provide links, or copies, or other memoranda related to exactly what took place that caused the earliest and most popular geocaching website to severe it’s relationship with “the father of geocaching.”
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Scout Offline
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    Posted: Mar. 02 2006,10:23 pm QUOTE

septic_tank, I think you've already learned that the history on gc.com was changed in June, 2001. (There's a coincidence: look to the left under my name for the date I joined Navicache.com ;-) By then, Dave Ulmer had developed a dim view of a hobby that consisted of leaving buckets of trading items scattered around the great outdoors. He promoted alternatives to geocaching, first cybercaching (where the trade items would be things you could download from the Internet), then Wonderts (essentially the same as virtual caches), then geographing (GPS + photography). Much of this can be read on the GPSstash mailing list archives.

Things came to a head when Dave took advantage of the Project Ape cache hidden near him. He was first-to-find and used the publicity to criticize the negative aspects of geocaching, as he saw them. It was at this time that his name was removed from the history of geocaching at gc.com. Luckily there are other sites that preserve the early history of the game. ;-)

Dave could be abrasive and convivial, free with both praise and criticism. He is unpredictable and enthusiastic. He has repeatedly said in various forums that he bears no ill will against gc.com or J. Irish. Dave is unique.


Edited by Scout on Mar. 02 2006,10:24 pm

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sept1c_tank Offline
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    Posted: Mar. 03 2006,12:27 am QUOTE

Quote (Scout @ Mar. 03 2006,12:23 am)
septic_tank, I think you've already learned that the history on gc.com was changed in June, 2001. (There's a coincidence: look to the left under my name for the date I joined Navicache.com ;-) By then, Dave Ulmer had developed a dim view of a hobby that consisted of leaving buckets of trading items scattered around the great outdoors. He promoted alternatives to geocaching, first cybercaching (where the trade items would be things you could download from the Internet), then Wonderts (essentially the same as virtual caches), then geographing (GPS + photography). Much of this can be read on the GPSstash mailing list archives.

Things came to a head when Dave took advantage of the Project Ape cache hidden near him. He was first-to-find and used the publicity to criticize the negative aspects of geocaching, as he saw them. It was at this time that his name was removed from the history of geocaching at gc.com. Luckily there are other sites that preserve the early history of the game. ;-)

Dave could be abrasive and convivial, free with both praise and criticism. He is unpredictable and enthusiastic. He has repeatedly said in various forums that he bears no ill will against gc.com or J. Irish. Dave is unique.


Scout, thanks for your reply.  As you have guessed, I know already the details of Dave and his attitude about 'stash or trash' from the GPSstash archives.  What I don't know (and would like some of the details) is the Ape episode.

The whole early history has fascinated me for a while now; I may try to put it all together in a comprehensive history some day.  The amount of information I have already compiled is staggering.  Who knows, I may even write a book!  :p

If for any reason you choose to avoid presenting this type of information publicly, I will understand (I know you know how to email me).

Thanks again, Richard.  :2cool :cool:
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whiteurkel Offline
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    Posted: Mar. 04 2006,7:00 pm QUOTE

Quote (sept1c_tank @ Mar. 03 2006,2:27 am)
The whole early history has fascinated me for a while now; I may try to put it all together in a comprehensive history some day.  The amount of information I have already compiled is staggering.  Who knows, I may even write a book!  :p

If for any reason you choose to avoid presenting this type of information publicly, I will understand (I know you know how to email me).

Thanks again, Richard.  :2cool :cool:


I had once asked at the Big Green Forums what turned Dave Ulmer against geocaching, and why he defaced the cache pages of all his caches, including the original stash. But this thread gives all the information a regular Joe like myself needs (that is someone who isn't thinking of writing a book :grinnin )

Sorry to hear Dave's other GPS game inventions didn't work, but I guess we should just leave that to Scout  :bow:

Hey Scout, I asked once, but could you hook me up with the code for one of those Navicache banners again? Forgot how to do it.


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Scout Offline
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    Posted: Mar. 04 2006,8:54 pm QUOTE

Quote (whiteurkel @ Mar. 04 2006,8:00 pm)
Hey Scout, I asked once, but could you hook me up with the code for one of those Navicache banners again? Forgot how to do it.

Click on "Your control panel"
then "Personal info"
then "Edit your profile".

In the box labeled "Your signature" put something like this:

Code Sample

<img src="http://geocaching.gpsgames.org/cgi-bin/sig.pl?user=Scout&txt=Want your own banner? Ask">


Edited by Scout on Mar. 04 2006,8:55 pm

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